I was 15. He was 22. He bought me take away food, alcohol and cigarettes for my company.
A decade later, he was my bosses boss. And harassed me at work.
He came from a wealthy family where he was the golden child, people around town know about his tastes but no one has come forward. His family are in denial.
That is not a particularly helpful way to engage with someone explaining what someone put them through.
If she did it doesnt seem like it would have done much to someone in his position, and may have carried risk for her. She doesnt owe us an explanation of how she handled things, regardless of how she navigated it or how it went.
In general when someone is explaining how they were harmed its generally not helpful to intergogate whether they handled it ācorrectlyā. Being a victim or being in a position in life where it is easier for you to be a victim rarely leaves you with many good options, or makes it easy to do things the ārightā way
Thank you very much, I really appreciate that. I donāt always know the best way to approach things but I do my best to treat people with the same care Iād want from folks that Iām in community with
Imagine if none of the victims nor their families reported on the Epstein pedophile ring, he would still be on that island trafficking children for sexual abuse to high profile executives to this day. Reporting works and end up in investigations and charges.
Yes, sometimes it does, but seeing as how the Epstein victims paid an incredible price to come forward and still havenāt adequately received justice decades later, even after massive outrage over one of the most well publicized and egregious sexual abuse firestorms the country has literally ever seen, that always has to be victims choice.
When people are harmed by being denied agency, stepping in to demand what they should or shouldnāt do is wrong. They are not obligated to take risks to try and fix someoneās wrong behavior that harmed them.
If I am ever sexually abused I will be doing my best to report it, but this is not my sexual abuse, and it is not my choice how to handle it. Demanding things of victims is innapropriate.
Report them to who? Actual violent rapes get reported to the authorities all the time and never get prosecuted. Plus, age of consent laws vary between states and are often subject to āRomeo and Julietā laws that take into account the gap between the consenting parties.
I think you may have a misunderstanding of how the legal system operates. They arenāt mandated to investigate and prosecute every instance where someone reports a crime, they get to pick and choose when and who they throw the book at.
Since the majority of authority figures are conservative men themselves, they often will take the side of the young men in these cases and choose to turn a blind eye. So reporting these crimes often ends up not bringing you any justice, and instead you end up being judged by the community for being sexually promiscuous.
Again, that misses my point. Victims do not owe random people an explanation of how they handled things, and requesting an explanation in response to someone sharing a harm they endured is unhelpful. That is not an indictment of you or your character, itās just important to me that people be able to express they were harmed without being subjected to questioning for it
Your second use of āhimā implies we may be reading the comment differently. If I am understanding correctly they are a woman who was abused by a male superior at work.
Regardless, people do not owe the world perfect victimhood, and whether we treat someoneās statement of harm with compassion should not be predicated on an evaluation of whether they ādid things rightā in the wake of the abuses they suffered.
Its a vulnerable thing to say you were harmed. Letās not interogate whether they performed victimhood correctly, and they dont owe us any details one way or another. It minimizes an expression of abuse that is generally not listened to in the first place.
Thought Iād confirm my gender is male and always has been. That was why my high school didnāt intervene or even provide support to me when they knew I was living with my older boyfriend.
I believe that that was why his colleagues at work didnāt think too hard about his email to the team saying heās off to pick up his boyfriend from high school. Or when I was given alcohol while underage when he brought me to company parties. (the same company I worked at years later and he harassed me at btw)
Apparently, being gay created a kind of shield of deniability, awkwardness and fear that people just didnāt want to deal with. If someone else comes forward and sets things in motion, I will put my hand up to testify. But Iām not going to drag myself through the mud just to re-live all that trauma in hope it may lead to something.
Last thing Iāll say is this. I came from a conservative family, I believe that my family household primed me for exploitation in a number of ways. Low self worth. Lack of agency. Lack of awareness of the world. Even before I moved out, I felt safer in bed with strangers than in the one my parents gave me.
Itās my firm believe that if Iād had parents who accepted me, or at least cared enough to truly look out for me, I wouldnāt have been abused for so many years.
Iām very glad it was appreciated. I try really hard to engage with people in a way that makes them feel respected, especially when it is around someone choosing to be vulnerable.
That is horrific. And yeah, I can absolutely see how that set of starting circumstances in life would make it so much harder to avoid exploitation and abuse. It is such a cruel reality that persistent mistreatment in your early life makes you much more vulnerable to further abuse later on.
Iām sending love. I hope you find the peace, joy, love, and healing in life that every person deserves.
Working in academia Iāve had to explain to a lot of girls that older men flirting with them repeatedly isnāt a normal thing and they should 100% report them to the proper channels if they felt uncomfortable. It sucks that even when thereās any amount of support itās still so poorly communicated.
Dating as a guy in your early 20s is a fucking minefield. Now that Iām 30 itās better because nobody lies about being in their upper 20s or 30s, anyone who would be illegal is easy to spot because people under about 22 look like actual children to me now, and if absolutely needed itās easy enough to just take any new dating prospect to a bar and let the bartender card them.
But back in my early 20s none of that was true. Half the women on dating apps were lying about their age. Judging age visually between about 16 and 20 can get really fuzzy. Also people who were 20 were still in my age range so taking them to a bar to get carded doesnāt work. Completely turned me off dating for a while.
if absolutely needed itās easy enough to just take any new dating prospect to a bar and let the bartender card them.
FYI this is not allowed to be used as a defense in court in some states (e.g. mine). If you card them and they have a fake ID, youāre still criminally culpable for anything untoward.
Seriously, whatās the option - oh you look slightly young, let me see your birth certificate? Wait that might be a forgery, show me your driverās license? Wait, that might be a forgery - show me an x-ray of your bones so I can analyze your growth plates.
Ignorance or belief as to victimās age no defense
When, in this chapter, the criminality of conduct depends upon the victimās being below a certain specified age, ignorance of the age is no defense. Neither shall misrepresentation of age by such person nor a bona fide belief that such person is over the [ā¦]
That is still not right though. If someone looks and acts 18+ and has a fake ID saying theyāre 18+ and they turn out yo be 16, well, there comes a point where you really handled in good faith. When good faith becomes punishable, were in bad territory
Ignorance or belief as to victimās age no defense
When, in this chapter, the criminality of conduct depends upon the victimās being below a certain specified age, ignorance of the age is no defense. Neither shall misrepresentation of age by such person nor a bona fide belief that such person is over the [ā¦]
Best thing, though unfortunately not quite possible, would be to check each otherās ID.
1. You can be certain about each otherās age.
2. Should they harm you, you now know who the other person is, and they get the same reassurance.
ā¦unless they have a fake ID. Which in turn is not in any way a defense should you perform certain acts with them that are illegal due to age. Youāre just supposed to be able to sense the difference between someone slightly above and slightly below the line in your jurisdiction.
FYI this is not allowed to be used as a defense in court in some states (e.g. mine). If you card them and they have a fake ID, youāre still criminally culpable for anything untoward.
I just started running when it happened to me. Charges canāt catch you if you outrun the minor. In hindsight, it was the right move. I would not have communicated anything with any level of coherence in a state of dripping terror
A minor attempted to flirt with them, they literally ran away
You canāt be charged with a crime if you do nothing wrong because you physically ran away and are faster than said minor
Running away was the correct thing to do
They were terrified (and sweaty) to the point where they were not capable of communicating coherently, and thus were not able to inform the minor that healthy adults would not be interested in their advances
I froze. I simultaneously was totally uninterested and also had no mental scripts for turning down attention from a girl when I was 19 and just sort ofā¦mentally stalled out, like my brain just stalled out.
Pie.GravityWell.xYz
VetOfTheSeas
One Punch Man tought us the perfect response to when a little girl approaches you.
I was 15. He was 22. He bought me take away food, alcohol and cigarettes for my company.
A decade later, he was my bosses boss. And harassed me at work.
He came from a wealthy family where he was the golden child, people around town know about his tastes but no one has come forward. His family are in denial.
Some people are just pure evil.
Iām so sorry this happened to you. I hope you are in a better place now.
Did you not report him?
That is not a particularly helpful way to engage with someone explaining what someone put them through.
If she did it doesnt seem like it would have done much to someone in his position, and may have carried risk for her. She doesnt owe us an explanation of how she handled things, regardless of how she navigated it or how it went.
In general when someone is explaining how they were harmed its generally not helpful to intergogate whether they handled it ācorrectlyā. Being a victim or being in a position in life where it is easier for you to be a victim rarely leaves you with many good options, or makes it easy to do things the ārightā way
Good god this feels like the only place on the internet right now with decent, reasonable, human takes. Thanks for typing this
Thank you very much, I really appreciate that. I donāt always know the best way to approach things but I do my best to treat people with the same care Iād want from folks that Iām in community with
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I hope you have a lovely day my friend.
Imagine if none of the victims nor their families reported on the Epstein pedophile ring, he would still be on that island trafficking children for sexual abuse to high profile executives to this day. Reporting works and end up in investigations and charges.
Yes, sometimes it does, but seeing as how the Epstein victims paid an incredible price to come forward and still havenāt adequately received justice decades later, even after massive outrage over one of the most well publicized and egregious sexual abuse firestorms the country has literally ever seen, that always has to be victims choice.
When people are harmed by being denied agency, stepping in to demand what they should or shouldnāt do is wrong. They are not obligated to take risks to try and fix someoneās wrong behavior that harmed them.
If I am ever sexually abused I will be doing my best to report it, but this is not my sexual abuse, and it is not my choice how to handle it. Demanding things of victims is innapropriate.
that implies kablez did not report him as no one including him came forward
Report them to who? Actual violent rapes get reported to the authorities all the time and never get prosecuted. Plus, age of consent laws vary between states and are often subject to āRomeo and Julietā laws that take into account the gap between the consenting parties.
I think you may have a misunderstanding of how the legal system operates. They arenāt mandated to investigate and prosecute every instance where someone reports a crime, they get to pick and choose when and who they throw the book at.
Since the majority of authority figures are conservative men themselves, they often will take the side of the young men in these cases and choose to turn a blind eye. So reporting these crimes often ends up not bringing you any justice, and instead you end up being judged by the community for being sexually promiscuous.
Again, that misses my point. Victims do not owe random people an explanation of how they handled things, and requesting an explanation in response to someone sharing a harm they endured is unhelpful. That is not an indictment of you or your character, itās just important to me that people be able to express they were harmed without being subjected to questioning for it
Your second use of āhimā implies we may be reading the comment differently. If I am understanding correctly they are a woman who was abused by a male superior at work.
Regardless, people do not owe the world perfect victimhood, and whether we treat someoneās statement of harm with compassion should not be predicated on an evaluation of whether they ādid things rightā in the wake of the abuses they suffered.
Its a vulnerable thing to say you were harmed. Letās not interogate whether they performed victimhood correctly, and they dont owe us any details one way or another. It minimizes an expression of abuse that is generally not listened to in the first place.
Thank you for writing this <3
Thought Iād confirm my gender is male and always has been. That was why my high school didnāt intervene or even provide support to me when they knew I was living with my older boyfriend.
I believe that that was why his colleagues at work didnāt think too hard about his email to the team saying heās off to pick up his boyfriend from high school. Or when I was given alcohol while underage when he brought me to company parties. (the same company I worked at years later and he harassed me at btw)
Apparently, being gay created a kind of shield of deniability, awkwardness and fear that people just didnāt want to deal with. If someone else comes forward and sets things in motion, I will put my hand up to testify. But Iām not going to drag myself through the mud just to re-live all that trauma in hope it may lead to something.
Last thing Iāll say is this. I came from a conservative family, I believe that my family household primed me for exploitation in a number of ways. Low self worth. Lack of agency. Lack of awareness of the world. Even before I moved out, I felt safer in bed with strangers than in the one my parents gave me.
Itās my firm believe that if Iād had parents who accepted me, or at least cared enough to truly look out for me, I wouldnāt have been abused for so many years.
š«
Iām very glad it was appreciated. I try really hard to engage with people in a way that makes them feel respected, especially when it is around someone choosing to be vulnerable.
That is horrific. And yeah, I can absolutely see how that set of starting circumstances in life would make it so much harder to avoid exploitation and abuse. It is such a cruel reality that persistent mistreatment in your early life makes you much more vulnerable to further abuse later on.
Iām sending love. I hope you find the peace, joy, love, and healing in life that every person deserves.
Take care kablez, I hope you have a lovely day :)
Like reporting people like this does anything.
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You did not just say that.
This is not up for debate. It is always rape if consent is not given, regardless of whether the authorities care or not.
Tell me youāre privileged without telling me youāre privileged
Crimes Unreported basically didnāt happen if the system doesnāt receive the report.
Iām getting a lot of reports on this. Chill on blaming the victims,
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Hi, youāre right, but please report this kind of stuff.
Ironic what gets reported isnāt a crime but the real crime not getting reported is being protected
Working in academia Iāve had to explain to a lot of girls that older men flirting with them repeatedly isnāt a normal thing and they should 100% report them to the proper channels if they felt uncomfortable. It sucks that even when thereās any amount of support itās still so poorly communicated.
I had a similar experience with my first crush. He let me down easy and acted like my big brother. I hope he found happiness in life.
Dating as a guy in your early 20s is a fucking minefield. Now that Iām 30 itās better because nobody lies about being in their upper 20s or 30s, anyone who would be illegal is easy to spot because people under about 22 look like actual children to me now, and if absolutely needed itās easy enough to just take any new dating prospect to a bar and let the bartender card them.
But back in my early 20s none of that was true. Half the women on dating apps were lying about their age. Judging age visually between about 16 and 20 can get really fuzzy. Also people who were 20 were still in my age range so taking them to a bar to get carded doesnāt work. Completely turned me off dating for a while.
FYI this is not allowed to be used as a defense in court in some states (e.g. mine). If you card them and they have a fake ID, youāre still criminally culpable for anything untoward.
They break the law, they lie, and you get in trouble still?
Seriously, whatās the option - oh you look slightly young, let me see your birth certificate? Wait that might be a forgery, show me your driverās license? Wait, that might be a forgery - show me an x-ray of your bones so I can analyze your growth plates.
Fucking hell
One of the many ridiculous laws implemented by performative GOP pearl-clutchers, half of whom are on the Epstein List.
Yeah that doesnāt sound right, even ethically.
If by your sincere knowledge youāre having a date with an adult, you shouldnāt get in trouble for anything
F.S.S. 794.021:
Sure
That is still not right though. If someone looks and acts 18+ and has a fake ID saying theyāre 18+ and they turn out yo be 16, well, there comes a point where you really handled in good faith. When good faith becomes punishable, were in bad territory
I agree with you but it seems several people here assumed I donāt.
Punishing people for sex that their imaginary friend wouldnāt approve of is far more important than justice or fairness to most people.
Itās not that blatant:
F.S.S. 794.021:
Best thing, though unfortunately not quite possible, would be to check each otherās ID.
1. You can be certain about each otherās age.
2. Should they harm you, you now know who the other person is, and they get the same reassurance.
But that conversation wouldnāt work.
ā¦unless they have a fake ID. Which in turn is not in any way a defense should you perform certain acts with them that are illegal due to age. Youāre just supposed to be able to sense the difference between someone slightly above and slightly below the line in your jurisdiction.
Wait, regular young people didnāt used to ask for ID on dates? I guess I was just paranoid.
The problem with this strategy is you can still be prosecuted for statutory rape even if you relied on a fake ID.
I can confirm this is the case in my state.
FYI this is not allowed to be used as a defense in court in some states (e.g. mine). If you card them and they have a fake ID, youāre still criminally culpable for anything untoward.
Unforch, knowing someoneās government name is disappointingly ineffective at preventing or remediating harm, in my experience.
I just started running when it happened to me. Charges canāt catch you if you outrun the minor. In hindsight, it was the right move. I would not have communicated anything with any level of coherence in a state of dripping terror
Iāve read this 3 times and I still donāt understand how these 4 sentences are supposed to work together.
Does that help explain it?
Full context in the spirit I meant it. Top marks
I froze. I simultaneously was totally uninterested and also had no mental scripts for turning down attention from a girl when I was 19 and just sort ofā¦mentally stalled out, like my brain just stalled out.
Right? Itās just a major surprise to suddenly be in crime territory with only careful conversation being a couth option
Tan white people Twitter?
The community name is a misnomer. The sidebar reads āWe allow tweets from anyoneā
Iām a white person. And Iām reading the tweet, so it fits!
So just name it people twitter lmao
You must be viewing this in an app that doesnāt show display names, because that is in fact the display name of this community
Rude towards all the AI slop bots reading this
Iām white and I can read this twitter post. it works.